Hey, I know I've asked this before. But could all nations be ranked according to their size on a daily basis? I think it would be really fun to see how big people are and would be fun to track progress and bragging rights. In our alliance we already have some on manually keeping track of every nation on our continent, every day.

I am not doing that for every single continent...

ooh, ooh, where do i rank [/grin]

Yes please. But make Gopher do it as a condition of him signing in.

I'm not sure if people are taking me to mean Gopher should just do rankings every day. I was thinking more of having that recorded by and shown by the game itself. AKA Johnmy programing it in.

You are currently 11th, slipping from 10th overnight after falling behind Star League.

Hey Gopher,

Do you know who is first? I'm curious to know.

that jerk! That's only because he thought it would be a great idea to attack super cool! I will have vengeance!

You really don't need me to tell you that you're the largest nation on Bravo/Charlie.

Whait, I'm the biggest country on the continent? I did not know that! How exciting?

You know what that means?

Answer: When smaller nations negotiate borders with me, they shouldn't try to bully me around and ask that they get all unclaimed land between the two, and claim land claim land that would take 2 months for them to reach. Instead they should hope that I'm charitable beyond what is good for me, and ask that we meet in the middle. So even though I am more powerful and could bully them into taking a worse deal, I give them a very good one for them instead.

I like this.

Of course you do, because like yellow, you think having a larger nation in an online game grants you reverence and the divine right to disrespect anyone with a nation smaller than yours.

I, on the other hand, believe that this is a game, and when playing a game I think it's important to be a good sport and show respect to the other players.

Since yellow isn't going to stop bringing this up until he's successfully goaded me into defending myself, here is the actual message he keeps referring to where I apparently attempted to bully him:
***** On October 22, 2009, at 1:44 am, StarScream wrote: *****
Greetings again Commander. My previously mentioned expansion plans have undergone necessary revision and I'd like to speak with you about diverting your eastward expansion in a northeasterly direction to allow me room to spread north. There is an equal amount of unclaimed land to the northeast so it would not result in any sort of delay in expansion for you and would allow us both to prosper.
*****
Sorry yellow, I didn't realize you'd get your panties all in a wad over a simple request. And you could have said no, and I'd have been fine with that. Instead you basically spat in my face and informed me that you are bigger than me and can do whatever you want. You see it wasn't your counter offer that I had a problem with. It was the way you chose to speak to me. And that's why you are losing land and resources fighting on yet another front. Because you refused to treat me with any respect. Oh sure, you'll win in the end. But you have my word you'll pay grievously before I fall.

Actually I only asserted that it is dumb for a nation to demand a treaty where I sacrfice almost all my possible expansion in an area, and they sacrfice none. I never said that I should I am not willing to sign fair border treateis that are halfway between myself and teh nation I am negotiating with. I never bullied you, or mistreated you, you're just trying to paint it like that so you can use fear to get other nations to join you and be your meat shield.

If you want to show messages here is one.

October 23, 2009 · 2:28:05 pm
I have sent you a treaty request. Pls accpet only if a first come first serve border agreement works for you. If you want negotiate a border treaty of another kind you can offer me one, but it must be more sensible than your past requests. I will not agree to any treaty that creates an indefinite vertical line across the continent that is keeps me from claiming territory that is far from your current country. A horizontal border, or diagonal one would be have much better chances.

You kept requesting unreasonable border agreements, and I offered you one last chance with the most flexible and loosid of of border agreements. The next morning when I check the map after update you attacked me while I was still trying to negotiate a border and keep peace. You are the agressor in this war.

Stupidly attacking a larger Nation doesn't make the larger nation immoral, lacking in character, or as you just put it, having bad sportmanship. No acting stupid, just makes you stupid.

If any nation in Star Scream and my vicintiy reads this please know. Once I sign a peace treaty with some one I hold to it. If I ally with some one, I'm fiercely loyal to them, and will spare no amount of dollars to help them.

Congratz, Star Scream. You've lost the game.

Yellow let me ask you something. If you are heading east and someone asks you if you are willing to head northeast, are you aware of the fact that would create a diagonal line? I only mention this because you claim I asked for something unreasonable when in fact I never asked for anything more than the diagonal line agreement you yourself just said was reasonable.

And now you are calling me a liar who uses other nations as meat shields. What nation would you be referring to with that claim? Rumland? Rumland is a friend of mine who you first attacked, which was also a factor in my attack on you. The only other nation over here that you share a boarder with is me. I am on the front line forming a shield for others, and I never asked anyone to contribute anything more than I have myself already done.

The truth is, you are so worried about little old me that you are spreading lies about me trying to get other nations to back stab me. I know this because they told me. So you can call me stupid for attacking you. Because frankly, judging by how you are conducting yourself right now, I couldn't care less about your opinion of me.

And for the record, I would rather lose the game fighting honorably, than win it with lies and deceitfulness.

Why don't the two of you just lock and load and throw down on each other and get it overwith?

I am enjoying the drama, however.

five bucks on yellow. starscream's repeated attempts at convincing us that there is a high moral standard in this game has begun to wear on my nerves. Newsflash, no one is obligated to sign a treaty of any sort nor are they obligated to agree to terms that they do not find beneficial. The fact that yellow has not run over everyone in his path so far is testament enough to his character, and you're repeated accusations of him being dishonorable by not agreeing to your terms doesn't change that.

The game is about negotiation and diplomacy; you refuse to negotiate, and you seem to be wanting to pick fights on the forums with super cool yellow, which isn't diplomacy. So far, you've just cemented people against you. Congratulations, you failed at talking to people.

I don't so much care that you have literally ignored/intentionally misinterpreted every thing I've said regarding the moral implications of backing out of a standing agreement (nobody but you was ever talking about anything else). I was merely stating my opinion and I'm sorry that offends you so much.

But what does bother me is you ignorantly claiming that I refused to negotiate with yellow. Since you obviously have no idea what you're talking about, I would appreciate it if you didn't make things up just because you don't like me and want to try and make me look bad. Grow up and get over it.

So this is an A and B conversation that I need to C my way out of?

Yeah, this thread quicly devolved into trolling back and forth.

That makes twice today that I broke my own no trolling policy.

Look man, I'm just trying to defend myself here. I didn't even want to say anything about this on the forums but this is like the 3rd time yellow has brought up my so called unreasonable boarder requests. What makes me really angry is that the agreements he publically said he found reasonable are the exact agreements I tried to make with him (first the horizontal line, which he ignored then the diagonal northeast line which triggered his angry reply). I never at any point asked for any vertical line border as he has publicly claimed.

I'm not trying to pick fights or piss anybody off. I simply had a choice to make. Rumland fell under attack by MCXA. Rumland had always been kind to me whereas yellow was not, so I picked a side. It may not be the winning side or even the popular side, but it's the side my heart feels is right. I just want to fight this war like a soldier without all the name calling and lies.

I've learned the hard way Star that sometimes its better just to shake your head, close the door and walk the other way. The Internet is a terrible place to debate.

That being said, there's a little much picking on Star going on here. And while he does have some valid points, and though he may be a little off base about one or two things, the world needs all kinds of players to make these games fun. It would suck and be boring if we were all the same. I personally admire someone who will take a side knowing he'll lose. That's a guy that you know will be in your corner regardless of the outcome. That's the kind of guy I would like to think of myself as. Like how I voted for my Libertarian candidate in the last election. I knew we wouldn't win, but goddammit, I picked the right side.

I get along with Yellow, and I make it a point to try to get along with most people. If I can be of any help to broker a cease fire between the two of you, either of you are free to message me at any time.

I tried libertarianism. The local group I attached myself to was more of a book of the month club though. Leader was some deusch that kept publishing books with titles like 'how i live free in an unfree world' and crap like that. heard people saying 'liberty' more times than you usually see in a textbook on the revolutionairy war. Rather unfortunate. Not like any other party is much better.

The Libertarian Party is full of crazy people and outright charlatans who want to print their own money and sell you herbal remedies for the shits. Its one of the most unfortunate things ever that we get saddled with such lunatics in our groups. I don't attend my local group here either. In Mississippi, people do crazy here as a hobby anyway without being Libertarian. I've never been anywhere in the country where I swear to God that a significant portion of the people who live in my town are certifiably nuts. Except this place. Business is good here though, so I'll stay.

several people in his path are alliance-mates :P

the problem is that soldiers are on the front lines and you are the leader of a supposed nation on a made up planet of johnny's imagining.

and from what i've seen:
1. you tried contacting SCY and he ignored you
2. you contacted me about talking to SCY
3. you asked SCY for a more convenient border agreement without making concessions
4. you invaded SCY when he didn't agree to your decree

these are the actions of leaders, not soldiers. soldiers don't make big decisions like these. a soldier's job is "locate, close with, and destroy the enemy by fire and maneuver, and repel the enemy’s assault by fire and close combat." this does relate in a very broad scale to a leader's role, in that they could have several battles going on at once, and would have to focus individual attention on each.

i won't tell you how i counseled SCY. his decisions are his to make, and that includes living with the consequences. currently, you two are in a state of open war. if either of you would like to work it out, i offer my assistance as a mediator as well. i can create an "alliance" called Star-SCY War, and invite the two of you and boogra, since he's pretty level headed and could act in the interests of Star, since i have an interest in SCY's growth because we are in the same alliance. then you can make your claims; scy can make his claims; the mediators can find a middle ground, and then you guys can have a little peace.

because honestly, starscream, when you hit SCY, you pushed north and west- the opposite direction of the land boundary you asked for, and used air attacks. granted, scy ignored your emails or rejected your claims to some land. but you proceeded in a manner that wasn't focused on finding a peaceful resolution at all. this is called diplomacy fail.

i look forward to hearing from you both and helping to forge a peaceful resolution to this current conflict.

When I said 'fight like soldiers' I meant fight with a sense of honor and reverence for the art of combat, rather than like a lot of lying double talking politicians. My intended meaning had nothing to do with the rank of soldier vs commander.

As far as I am concerned, diplomacy with yellow failed when he sent his biting refusal to work with me on a border agreement. I made two very reasonable offers (the same offers he has openly admitted to being reasonable) and rather than make a counter offer, he ignored me, then ran his mouth at me. At no point did he offer what HE would define as reasonable or propose any borderlines of his own. If he had, or if he had actually READ the proposals I made (since they were in fact the same proposals he has said here were reasonable), I think an agreement would have been reached.

But that's completely irrelevant. My attack on yellow had little to do with boarder agreements, as you seem so convinced. My attack was based on two factors: yellow attacked Rumland, and yellow got mouthy with me. I fight for rumland and to avenge an insult. Unfortunately I do not expect that Rumland will survive, but I would much rather share his ill fate than turn my back on a good man.

if he rejects your offer, that is his counteroffer.

at the time of attacking, your only excuse was that he was belligerent with you, yet i have seen no evidence posted that he actually was.

If I was a Department of Safety director I'd declare this thread condemned. I believe all I would have to say is: "Flame War!" and then slap a sticker on it marking it unfit for habitation.

Also, Star, you're doing it wrong. Here's a link to an explanation on how to flame war properly. Mind you, you have to be doing it for the lulz.

http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Flame_war
(link not necessarily safe for people of any age or anyone at all)

-The Kestrel

No a rejection is not an offer. There is a difference.

My attack came two days after rumland started losing ground. Please get your facts straight.

rejection is an offer. he just happens to be offering you the business end of a gun. not a very happy offer, mind you, but then, that just means you should have kissed more ass.

I'm not so good at that I'm afraid. Being a royal pain in the ass on the other hand...

do not even think to claim a position of mastery at being a royal pain in the ass. your forum warrior skills are lax at best, and your posting is inevitably going to devolve into whining and moaning at the inevitable steamroll that will be applied to your territory once everyone who wishes to shut you up finally bothers to devote resources to the otherwise meaningless inane front that you have created with your inability to understand how to negotiate with larger more powerful entities!

Okay, you know what, I'm tried of this nonsense. You're right. I'm a horrible person who fails at everything. You are better than me and I am super jealous and/or terrified of you and your unstoppable alliance that is undoubtedly going to win the game. Now would you please stop with the impotent smartass remarks and find something else to amuse yourself.