With the spawn point system people on large continents are setting and resetting because whoever is at the edge has the advantage. Just wondering if Drypto in going to be random placement, I heard rumors.

I thought I blocked users from resigning from worlds that hadn't launched yet, but I just looked and see that I modified the minimum length of time instead. I can't recall why I did that. I don't think I like that ability.

I think I may go the alternating route, which would make Drypto and Einio random spawn (since Ankylo and Borogov were selectable). I may add a week or two to their start dates, as well.

there goes strategically ganging up on people xD

I believe it was so that people could make a change when they get surrounded by one alliance (or maybe it was because I whined enough)

nah, it was just to have variations of how we start on maps.

2 maps one way, another two a different way

Which is what happened to me which is why I moved yesterday.

I think random will be best, it's the only way that there's no initial advantage and puts everyone on a level playing field.

Spawn points are to restrictive to people who place early, and give too much freedom to those who join late. Then again, I feel that is the main weakness this game has in all facets.

I think if you're going to allow countries to join before the world starts that map should be random, but if you get to choose where you start you should be able to set attacks immediately. I still don't like my second option I gave, but I think it's more fair than the current system.

I'd vote for the random idea, since I (stupidly) joined early, and am now surrounded on both maps. I'd play it out if we're stuck, although I have to admit I've considered resigning and restarting.

I bet, if Johnny were to create a sign up list, there would be more than 30 countries. I, and I am sure that a lot of other players, am waiting to closer to the startup to create my country. I made the early placement mistake on Certo. I had to move or be enclosed with the Nodians.

I think a semi-random placement, where we would be basically equally spaced. An idea for this would be to create a series of spawn points where everyone would be on one point. Johnny would randomly assign who starts where and newcomers would randomly spawn on one of the existing points. I do see that grabbing vacant spawn points would be the mission of the day (unless they aren't visible).

Just a thought...

I am waiting until the last minute to join for all of the reasons mentioned above.

My point has been proven.

Look north of the Eastern Spawn point, countries have placed and replaced so much that they have moved well beyond the spawn point range.

I've pushed back the start date on Drypto and Einio a week and I'm going to change the join page on those worlds soon to do random country placement instead of allowing the user to choose.

To prevent users from just resigning and choosing a new spot right away, I think I'm also going to change the resign criteria. Instead of allowing users to resign after 24 hours, I think I'm going to bump it up to a week.

Any thoughts on those changes?

Will placement be made immediately or will it be done at the start?

As for one week. how about 50% of the remaining time until start up?

Personally, I would like to see placement randomly on the day before start up so that we can see where we are can can develop some form of strategy. Maybe have people be able to join and be placed randomly for the first week or two. That way, if you don't like your placement, you have to resign and get placed again.

I think a week would be too long for most maps. Look at Bogorov for instance, it's been running for only 5-6 weeks and there's almost no unclaimed land. Unless resign in the first week or two of the world you might as well not rejoin.

Does that mean that those of us who are already on there have our positions, or that it'll be random regardless of startup?

Immediately. This will let players consider strategy before the game starts.


<i>As for one week. how about 50% of the remaining time until start up?</i>

Resigning before the game starts is disabling entirely. I meant players won't be able to resign for a week after the game starts or after they join. That means people have to work with their placements instead of just quitting and trying again. I think the whole point of having random placement is that you should be stuck with what you get to some degree.

Also, random worlds will be random <i>permanently</i>. They're really going to operate quite differently. It'll be interesting to see what happens.

It would actually be fantastic if the map would fill up that quickly. That means there are a lot of active players, which means that world can be closed to joins and a new world can be added.

I'm going to clear all existing countries. People will have to rejoin and get a new random spawn location.

When will the wipe happen? Just before?

Possibly tonight or tomorrow, depending on when I get a chance.

johnny, you removed my country is ok but how do i go back in the game because i cant resign -.- and it says that im still in it...

Same here. Infinite loop.

Sorry! I thought I got all the necessary tables, but obviously forgot one!

It should be working correctly now.

haha it ok man^^ thanks you!! lol hah

I foresee an issue with the random placement, People who join at the last will be more likely able to grow as they probably won't be surrounded.

I would still like to see the placement done in the last couple of days before start up from a list of signees. Two days are plenty for people to devise some form of strategy. Really, I can't decide how I am going to move until all the people are placed anyway. There really isn't any reason to place as we sign up (unless it is easier for you).

That's always the case, though, in either scenario.

Right now, the randomization algorithm starts at one of the spawn points (chosen randomly). One change I could make that could really alter everything would be to make the algorithm start at a completely random spot. So, you won't necessarily start near anyone when you're dropped.

I like the idea of having small clusters, but I could see going either route.

The only issue I have with close clusters is that you will end up with someone on the outside, which will allow them to grow easier than others. That said, that's part of the chance you take with a Random Placement.

Mayhaps a compromise would be place everyone two days before the start, in a random order, rather than place them as soon as they register? Or perhaps allow in a random placement that there are more spawns, or have the placements allowed to be farther than the current 150/100 setup?

But with a "true" random drop, yes, there will always be someone on "the outside" but statistically that "outside" would be smaller than it is with everyone clustered.

Considering the points made and the overwhelming response in the poll, I'm going to change the algorithm to be fully random. Once I get a chance (probably later this week), I'll update it and replace everyone in new positions using the new algorithm.

If the random placement is made just prior to starting the map means that there is no advantage to waiting to sign up. This way, everyone has the same odds of being on the edge.

I like the idea of closing the signup 2 days (plenty of time for strategizing) prior to the map start, then placing everyone on it. New placement could resume 1 day after startup. This makes is actually a disadvantage to try to beat the odds and get out on the fringe.

I think Tim's idea of just placing all the countries before the world starts is a good one.

I don't know if the randomization algorithm is working correctly yet anyway since on Drypto there are 25 countries crammed into the West half and only 6 on the East.

I like that suggestion, but I'm going to swap the times. The countries will be placed one day before the map launches, then joins will be blocked for two (or more) days after launch.

Sometimes after a bunch of discussion, I can't even remember why I do things a certain way. haha

Since the random spawn system is <i>completely</i> random now (and no longer clustered around spawn points), is there any reason to delay placing people on the map until 24 hours before? And should there be a block in join from one day until two days after?

Since everything's random now, it seems to me that none of that is relevant anymore. Am I missing something?

After some more thought, I can't think of any good reason to block users from joining now that it's always a fully random spawn location. It could prevent users from getting involved on a map if they try to join and find out they have to wait, which I think is a big drawback.

So, joins are never blocked and countries are again placed immediately.

This is a silly question and forgive me if it's been answered elsewhere...

DO the world maps wrap?

No

If I may ask, what are the parameters for the random country placement algorithm? I've just noticed some patterns with how countries are placed about the world and want to know if I'm right.

The script selects a random point on the map, then, from that point, it keeps jumping around at random angles until it finds a suitable location (enough land, and far enough away from other players).